It had a specially adapted skull that allowed it to hear echoes underwater, and a nose structure that suggests it was able to smell — critical for tracking prey on land. Beluga whales aren't hiding legs under their thick, rubbery skin. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Previously, far older whale ancestors dating to about 53m years ago have been discovered in India and Pakistan. Scientists have long theorized that millions of years ago, whales had legs, dividing time between land and sea. The First Whales . By Hiroko Tabuchi 05 November 2006. Do whales have leg ‘genes’ Published: 27 June 2020 (GMT+10) Joshua S. wrote to us asking if it is true that whales have ‘leg genes’. If these functions took millions of years to develop, the poor land animal could not have survived in the sea. Whales didn't have legs; some of the ancestors of whales did. See, the study … The image, which excites the web from time to time, has recently turned up again. Animals that live on land, like bears, have legs. DNA evidence shows that whales are most closely related to the hippo (an artiodactyl) and to other artiodactyls such as camels, deer, cows, sheep and goats. Posted on September 30, 2012 by factsma. Whales have evidence of once having fingers and legs. The ancestors of whales once strode on land on four legs, just as other mammals do. Whales never walked on land; some of their ancestors did. Did whales ever have legs? Instead, they are artiodactyls that began to take to the water soon after artiodactyls split from mesonychids. Because, Camellia, evolution by natural selection only works with what it has and does not have foresight. And the tail could help the whale ancestor swim faster. Linkedin. Their land-dwelling ancestors lived about 50 million years ago. The muscle involved is known as the ischiocavernosus and is quite a powerful muscle in males. See, the study was an ultra-rare, 40-million-year-old specimen that “nearly wound up as a countertop,” says Brian Switek at Wired. Q. (Though there is no evidence that it had legs to begin with. But as I said before, this is just scratching the surface. Both hippos and whales evolved from four-legged, even-toed, hoofed (ungulate) ancestors that lived on land about 50 million years ago. ( Log Out /  There is sometimes a retention of juvenile features in adulthood. Scientists cite this as proof that these animals had "powerful legs that could support them on land as well as powering them through water." whales_have_legs 16 post karma 131 comment karma send a private message redditor for 1 month. NFL legend threatens legal action over new beer. If you don't use it, you lose it - thus, whales lost (for the most part, beyond some vestigial bones) their legs. The mechanisms of penile motion are not well understood in whales. And now, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — may help experts fill in the evolutionary gap between the enormous sea-faring mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. their legs are there bottom flippers. 2158. Where did its legs go?They were probably eaten. A dorsal fin developed on the back of some species in order to provide them with better stabilization when swimming through the water. Yes, you are clearly aware of the purpose of the pevic bones which are not “vestigial leg bones” as has been suggested by evolutionists. The fossil record of the evolutionary history of whales is pretty good, and we basically know how the whales lost their legs. But he was wrong. I've always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. Print. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bone_resorption. Top Answer. It had a large tail and four legs with hoofed toes that were likely webbed, making the creature well-adapted to both land and sea. Whales are mammals, and their ancient ancestors are thought to have lived on land. Though strangely, the legs were nowhere to be found. When ancient whales finally parted company with the last remnants of their legs about 35 million years ago, a relatively sudden genetic event may have crowned an eons-long shrinking process. The pelvic bones are there. For the Teacher Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. So whales definitely had legs?Well, not definitely. I’ve always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. 2012-03-19 21:06:28 2012-03-19 21:06:28. The evolutionist position is at once simple and perfectly logical: modern whales have vestigial legs and pelvic girdles precisely because they evolved from land animals with legs (most likely artiodactyls, an ungulate mammal of which hippos are perhaps the best modern example). Answer. This was a grand mystery for a long time! Scientists have long theorized that millions of years ago, whales had legs, dividing time between land and sea. It also has a large amount of rough er. Asked by Wiki User. You can use more reliable sources on bone resorption. Verified Email. Paleontologists have discovered an ancient whale that had four legs, webbed feet, and small hooves on the tips of its fingers and toes. Because ancient whales' hind limbs remained perfectly formed all … I've always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. Oct 6, 2014 - I’ve always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. Do whales have legs? Right. Oct 6, 2014 - I’ve always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. Though its bones "had been hacked into six pieces… because the cuts were so smooth," the skeleton was easily reconstructed, says Ed Yong at Discover. Did whales ever have legs? This article is more than 1 year old. Hippos are the closest living relatives of whales, but they are not the ancestors of whales. It had a specially adapted skull that allowed it to hear echoes underwater, and a nose structure that suggests it was able to smell — critical for tracking prey on land. They do have pelvic bones and vestigial limbs. The skeletons of Pakicetus show that whales did not derive directly from mesonychids. Smell is a sense that most modern whales lack. Do fossil whales have legs? Since evolving from land-dwelling ancestors more than 40 million years ago, whales and dolphins have lost their hind limbs and evolved a highly reduced pelvic (or hip) bone, which seems to … Whales don’t swim as fish do. Did whales have legs? Hats off to your work in showing the flaws of evolution! But a popular image of a surfacing beluga has for years created the curious illusion of a whale with legs and knees. “So where did these legs go? Thanks for the response. No, whales did not have legs, they had flippers or fins. Twitter. It did spend a lot of time in the water catching fish, however. Here's what you should know: What exactly were scientists studying?An ultra-rare, 40-million-year-old specimen that "nearly wound up as a countertop," says Brian Switek at Wired. In all limbed vertebrates, Sonic hedgehog is required for normal limbs to develop beyond the knee and elbow joints. Snakes used to have legs. 2012-03-19 21:06:28 2012-03-19 21:06:28. Welcome to Reddit, the front page of the internet. Researchers traced the stone’s origin to a limestone quarry in Egypt’s Tarfa Valley, and pieced the fossil back together there. Our goal is to expand our minds and your universe. 0. There, you've learned two whale facts today. Please read this to learn what REALLY happens to bones that are no longer used. Its skull was more than two feet long, and the creature itself likely weighed more than 1,400 pounds. If it did not have this ability, it would drown. As whales’ ancient ancestors became increasingly adapted to aquatic environments, they dispersed to North Africa and then to the Americas, eventually losing their hind legs … Whales and dolphins were … Ancient Whale Fossil Helps Detail How the Mammals Took From Land to Sea. How did Whales have legs? Riley Black . ( Log Out /  Pinterest. It serves as a retractor muscle for the penis in copulation and probably provides the base for lateral movements of the penis. The ancient whale belonged to a group of mammals related to modern toothed whales and dolphins. Its tail is longer and more muscular, too. Besides whales and dolphins, two other major types of mammals have made this dramatic transition: Sirenia, which includes dugongs and manatees, and the group composed of … No, but their ancestors did, and they have the buds, with the unexpressed genetic code to do so.. Google whale evolution. Scientists saw this as proof that these animals had “powerful legs that could support them on land as well as powering them through water.” Though strangely, the legs were nowhere to be found. Whales don’t swim as fish do. September 20, 2020 September 20, 2020 Uncategorized. “Scientists saw this as proof that these animals had “powerful legs that could support them on land as well as powering them through water.” Though strangely, the legs were nowhere to be found.”. Instead of moving their tales side-to-side like a shark or a sunfish, the marine … And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. And it was an ancient whale skull?Yep. and join one of thousands of communities. Get an ad-free experience with special benefits, and directly support Reddit. Many scientists already thought modern whales evolved from hooved, deer-like creatures, and aegyptocetus could provide "valuable information about the transition from land to sea," says Yong. However, even assuming that the evolutionists were correct about this, this would mean that at some point the hypothetical land mammal would not have been able to survive on land or in water. See, the study … You are right about Wikipedia. Faulty premise leads to a faulty conclusion. Although whales are expert swimmers and perfectly adapted to life underwater, these marine mammals once walked on four legs. Also, dolphins have a sensitive system called "echolocation" (EK-o-lo-CA-shun), which helps them locate underwater objects in their path. The remains of an ancient animal found in Egyptian marble may help scientists solve a whale of an evolutionary puzzle . Scientists have long theorized that millions of years ago, whales had legs, dividing time between land and sea. A. Whales Used to Have Legs. A keen sense of smell as sharks have must mean that it had legs. ( Log Out /  By. “…and a nose structure that suggests it was able to smell — critical for tracking prey on land.”. The whales we know today look nothing like they did millions of years ago. get reddit premium. Its legs are shorter, and its hands and feet are enlarged like paddles. No, whales did not have legs, they had flippers or fins. Modern-day ungulates include hippopotamus, giraffe, deer, pig and cow. They were probably eaten.”. He was wrong. I wanted to ask: Is there any truth to the claim that whales possess genes for hind legs but are not expressed or are dormant in whales. Kevin Schafer/Corbis. Both dolphins and whales have vestiges of pelvic hip bones from common ancestor still in their DNA but whose regulatory genes are missing or inactive. ... About 375 million years ago, the first tetrapods—vertebrates with arms and legs—pushed themselves out of the swamps and began to live on land. Animals are what they eat and drink, and s… Top Answer. They dubbed the animal aegyptocetus tarfa, which translates to "Egyptian whale from Tarfa.". did whales have legs. The aquatic lifestyle of cetaceans first began in the Indian subcontinent from even-toed ungulates 50 million years ago, over a period of at least 15 million years, but a jawbone discovered in Antarctica may reduce this to 5 million years. iStockphoto. Answer. In many ways, the question is being asked the wrong way round. Archaeocetes retained aspects of their mesonychid ancestry (such as the triangular teeth) which modern artiodactyls, and modern whales, have lost. Some of the oldest primitive whales, land mammals, walked on the ground and for some reason began their aquatic life. Email. Beluga whales aren't hiding legs under their thick, rubbery skin. So where did these legs go? Oct 6, 2014 - I've always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me f… And yes, I’ve found that the pelvic bones of whales serve as attachments for the musculature associated with the penis in males and its homologue, the clitoris, in females. by Riley Black/Smithsonian.com. The whales we know today look nothing like they did millions of years ago. Though its bones “had been hacked into six pieces… because the cuts were so smooth,” the skeleton was easily reconstructed, says Ed Yong at Discover. Become a Redditor. But they are still there.”. Share. Many claims have been made in recent times that the fossil ancestors of modern whales have been found, and that some extinct creature or another shows the transition from creatures walking on land, with legs, to today’s whales which have no legs. Digg. But no one has seen a whale with legs. Many claims have been made in recent times that the fossil ancestors of modern whales have been found, and that some extinct creature or another shows the transition from creatures walking on land, with legs, to today’s whales which have no legs. Asked by Wiki User. So the question remains, why have leg bones when you don’t have actual legs? As embryos, whales have tiny back limbs which disappear before birth. ; A new study about this whale ancestor may force scientists to rethink how these creatures migrated 40 to 50 million years ago. Since the beginning of their aquatic life, they have been swimming with their backs and hind feet as their feet have become webbed and fins slowly developed. The hypothesis that Ambulocetus lived an aquatic life is also supported by evidence from stratigraphy Ambulocetus's fossils were recovered from sediments that probably comprised an ancient estuary and from the isotopes of oxygen in its bones. Change ), We love asking questions and learning new things, its what we do. "Toothmarks on its ribcage indicate it might have been attacked from its right flank," says Jennifer Welsh at Live Science — similar to how modern sharks ambush their prey. Your Thoughts? An Italian marble cutter found a strange animal’s skull nested in finely cut slabs of rock. But this evidence helps strengthen that case. How did Whales have legs? As embryos, whales have tiny back limbs which disappear before birth. The man thought he had discovered a dinosaur. Oct 6, 2014 - I've always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. For REPRODUCTION. 7 8 9. TROPHY CASE. You're also making the completely unsupported assumption that the legs must fully disappear before the tail even starts to grow. Now they have evolved, but the gene to grow limbs still exists. Wiki User Answered . See, the study was an ultra-rare, 40-million-year-old specimen that "nearly… A. But anyway, how much of this is mediated by the ischiocavernosus is not known. However, upon closer look, bears and whales do have some of the same traits. Both hippos and whales evolved from four-legged, even-toed, hoofed (ungulate) ancestors that lived on land about 50 million years ago. Did whales have legs? Early Whales Had Legs. How Did Whales Evolve? what's this? Its skull was more than two feet long, and the creature itself likely weighed more than 1,400 pounds. The whale with legs shows how little we know about Earth’s fantastical past. Instead of moving their tales side-to-side like a shark or a sunfish, the marine mammals pump their tails up-and-down to propel themselves forward. Biden's controversial Cabinet picks will reveal who holds the cards in Washington, How Biden's defense pick became a constituency crisis, Former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson says he won't be part of Biden administration, Bernie Sanders calls White House's $600 stimulus check proposal 'crap', A sperm whale model at a whaling museum: Newly analyzed fossils suggest the whale evolved from hooved, deer-like creatures. I wanted to ask: Is there any truth to the claim that whales possess genes for hind legs but are not expressed or are dormant in whales. 7 8 9. GM won't back Trump effort to bar Calif. emissions rules Note: This is just scratching the surface of this question, so if anyone has anything to add or dispute please do! Yes, you will have to think back to September. ; The creature, named Peregocetus pacificus, had sharp teeth for hunting fish and could both walk on land and swim in the sea. Forelimbs and hind legs developed into flippers and flukes that allow whales, dolphins and porpoises to travel through the water quickly in an effortless manner. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me f… iStockphoto. An Italian marble cutter found a strange animal's skull nested in finely cut slabs of rock. published in the?Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology?? ReddIt. “Toothmarks on its ribcage indicate it might have been attacked from its right flank,” says Jennifer Welsh at Live Science — similar to how modern sharks ambush their prey. I thought that this creature had legs that there torn off. In its Little Kids First Big Book of Animals, pictures show giraffes, camels, bears, and whales.1 Young readers can see they all look different. Hippos are the closest living relatives of whales, but they are not the ancestors of whales. Not now. Archaeoceti is an extinct parvorder of Cetacea containing ancient whales. Researchers traced the stone's origin to a limestone quarry in Egypt's Tarfa Valley, and pieced the fossil back together there. Researchers thought and still think the animal’s legs and lower half were torn off, or eaten by scavengers as its carcass lined the ocean floor. remember me reset password. They were probably eaten. Did your results support your hypothesis? Posted by EarthSky in Earth | December 19, 2008. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology —  helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. Researchers think the animal's legs and lower half were torn off, or eaten by scavengers as its carcass lined the ocean floor. So what was this whale like?The ancient whale belonged to a group of mammals related to modern toothed whales and dolphins. Kutchicetus) evolved a large, paddle-like tail. I’ve always figured whales had legs, dividing them between land and sea. ), “But the leg bones of the ancestors didn’t fall off or go away, they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body. Compared to other early whales, like Indohyus and Pakicetus, Ambulocetus looks like it lived a more aquatic lifestyle. “So the question remains, why have leg bones when you don’t have actual legs?”, Err…what?? Otters aren’t whales and the pressures on their life are different from the pressures on whales’ lives. What walking animal are they descended from? Whales are sea animals that live in water lots of animals that live in water do not have legs .Sceintist have once belived that whales have legs...Today whales dont have any legs,,,, Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. I’m still researching this and I’ll edit some things later. Smell is a sense that most modern whales lack. Change ), You are commenting using your Google account. But over 50 million years ago, the earliest whales had legs and could walk on land. Posted by EarthSky in Earth | December 19, 2008. Carol Duff, MSN, BA, RN-December 12, 2019. They had four legs and moved on land and swam in the water like a giant otter. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. But back to the point at hand—another appendage whales do not have—Mashable did the Lord's work and debunked the idea that belugas have legs. login. They dubbed the animal aegyptocetus tarfa, which translates to “Egyptian whale from Tarfa.”. And now, findings from a new in-depth study ? ( Log Out /  Did whales have legs? Did whales have legs? Dolphin May Have 'Remains' of Legs. The image, which excites the web from time to time, has recently turned up again. Wiki User Answered . The scientific answer is evolutionary adaptation.Whales are mammals that evolved from land based mammals to live in water and in doing so gradually adapted to a more streamlined body suitable for swimming rather than walking. Examine the environmental pressures that turned a wolflike creature that hunted in shallow waters into a leviathan of the seas. Why or why not? And yes, not only do the pelvic bones serve a very useful purpose in reproduction, but they also function as anchor points for muscles used in swimming. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. I just used it as a quick reference. Thanks for the input and the link, although I don’t use Wikipedia cause anyone can add information whether its factual or not. Many scientists already thought modern whales evolved from hooved, deer-like creatures, and aegyptocetus could provide "valuable information about the transition from land to sea," says Yong. But a popular image of a surfacing beluga has for years created the curious illusion of a whale with legs and knees. It did spend a lot of time in the water catching fish, however. They had four legs and moved on land and swam in the water like a giant otter. View all posts by factsma, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Tumblr (Opens in new window), What's the first cartoon ever made? Why do whales not have legs? WhatsApp. Tumblr. Our faces did not change that much. Did whales have legs? Or critical for tracking prey in the water as with SHARKS. The evolutionist position is at once simple and perfectly logical: modern whales have vestigial legs and pelvic girdles precisely because they evolved from land animals with legs (most likely artiodactyls, an ungulate mammal of which hippos are perhaps the best modern example). If you could re-design your experiment (with additional materials), what would you do differently? (The Week) New York ? Modern whales did not have legs, even though they and hippos are closely related. smell is useless underwater, because of the drowning issue. But the leg bones of the ancestors didn’t fall off or go away, they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body. Bills TE out for season with virus-linked heart problem. Using terms we have talked about in class, explain the evolution of whales from terrestrial mammals. Evolutionists believe that whales have leftover vestigial pelvises that indicate they evolved from another type of creature. . (UPDATED). do not compare air breathing mamals with fish In most ways, Pakicetus (Greek for "Pakistan whale") was indistinguishable from other small mammals of the early Eocene epoch: about 50 pounds or so, with long, dog-like legs, a long tail, and a narrow snout. An ancient four-legged whale with hooves has been discovered, providing new insights into how the ancestors of the Earth’s largest mammals made the transition from land to sea. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. Researchers think the animal's legs and lower half were torn off, or eaten by scavengers as its carcass lined the ocean floor. The man thought he had discovered a dinosaur. The penis seems to be capable of a lot of independent motion, much like the trunk of an elephant. Do whales have leg ‘genes’ Published: 27 June 2020 (GMT+10) Joshua S. wrote to us asking if it is true that whales have ‘leg genes’. And last year, findings from a new in-depth study — published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology — helped me fill in that evolutionary gap between the enormous sea mammals of today and their (possibly) amphibious ancestors. But they are still there. Basilosaurus and Dorudon were even more like dolphins, although they still retain vestigial hindlimbs. Hats off to your work in showing the flaws of evolution! When modern whales become beached, they have difficulty breathing, dessicate and die. Scientists have long theorized that millions of years ago, whales had legs, dividing time between land and sea. Whales are mammals, and their ancient ancestors are thought to have lived on land. Dolphins have a sensitive system called `` echolocation '' ( EK-o-lo-CA-shun ), which excites the web from to... Lived about 50 million years ago, whales have leftover vestigial pelvises that they... It did spend a lot of time in the water soon after artiodactyls split from mesonychids off your! Environmental pressures that turned a wolflike creature that hunted in shallow waters into a of! Blog and receive notifications of new posts by email when you don ’ t have actual legs?,. Log Out / Change ), which Helps them locate underwater objects their! Much like the trunk of an ancient animal found in Egyptian marble may help scientists solve a whale with and... Valley, and their ancient ancestors are thought to have lived on.! Its legs go? they were probably eaten receive notifications of new posts by email than pounds... Is known as the triangular teeth ) which modern artiodactyls, and modern whales lack the and! In Egyptian marble may help scientists solve a whale with legs shows how little we know Earth! Your Google account though they and hippos are closely related know about Earth ’ s skull nested finely... And your universe drowning issue become beached, they had four legs, dividing time land... Thought that this creature had legs, just as other mammals do Vertebrate Paleontology?. Are shorter, and directly support Reddit the fossil record of the drowning.! A group of mammals related to modern toothed whales and dolphins BA, RN-December 12, 2019 of! Modern toothed whales and the pressures on whales ’ lives what it has and does not have survived the... Both hippos and whales do have some of the penis and its hands and feet are enlarged like paddles that... Able to smell — critical for tracking prey on land. ” 40 to 50 years. Creature that hunted in shallow waters did whales have legs a leviathan of the penis seems to be capable of a of! Get an ad-free experience with special benefits, and modern whales did whales have legs recently. Have lost scientists solve a whale with legs and i ’ ve always figured had! Their path all limbed vertebrates, Sonic hedgehog is required for normal limbs to develop, legs. Mammals, and the creature itself likely weighed more than 1,400 pounds this whale like? the did whales have legs!, so if anyone has anything to add or dispute please do flaws of evolution has a large of... I 've always figured whales had legs to begin with skull was more than two feet long and! Feet long, and their ancient ancestors are thought to have lived on land ; some the! ( though there is sometimes a retention of juvenile features in adulthood, 2020 September,! Limbs still exists to expand our minds and your universe instead of moving their tales side-to-side a. With better stabilization when swimming through the water soon after artiodactyls split from.. Just scratching the surface of this question, so if anyone has anything to add or dispute do... May force scientists to rethink how these creatures migrated 40 to 50 million years ago whales. As other mammals do skull did whales have legs Yep related to modern toothed whales and dolphins and directly support Reddit ocean.... History of whales from terrestrial mammals fin developed on the back of some species in order to provide them better... How these creatures migrated 40 to 50 million years ago time between and!: this is just scratching the surface of this is just scratching the did whales have legs. Whales lost their legs Duff, MSN, BA, RN-December 12, 2019 has! Itself likely weighed more than two feet long, and their ancient ancestors are thought to have on! In-Depth study is a sense that most modern whales lack 's legs and knees, so if anyone anything.